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Grappling with Issues – 5/21/10

Would you prefer Alistair Overeem fought Fedor Emelianenko or signed with the UFC before the end of 2010? What would you tell Andrei Arlovski after watching him lose for the third straight time? Is Matt Lindland on his last leg where current relevance in MMA is concerned? Are you more excited about the heavyweight headliners at Moosin MMA or the battle between bad-ass Betties a few fights down on the card?

Keyboard warrrrriors….come out to plaaaay-yay!

If you’re reading these lines you’ve made it through another work-week and are back in the friendly digital confines of “Grappling with Issues”, our site’s resident Friday feature highlighting insight and opinion from Adam Tool and myself on six subjects plucked from the Mixed Martial Arts landscape. However, just because we staffers get the fancy set-up, please don’t feel precluded from dishing out your own thoughts on each matter in the comments section at the bottom of the column…

More appealing match-up at this weekend’s Moosin MMA event – Tim Sylvia vs. Mariusz Pudzianowski or Tara LaRosa vs. Roxanne Modafferi?

Adam Tool: In essence this question is asking which fight I’ll be looking for first when I hit the internet Saturday morning to catch up on some fights, and the answer is LaRosa vs. Modafferi. I could care less about anything Tim Sylvia does anymore; he lost a big chunk of whatever respect I had for him following is 36 second clowning at the hands of Fedor Emelianenko. He could have salvaged his career by coming back with a hard-fought win over a respectable opponent, but instead he got knocked out in less than 10 seconds by a 48 year old boxer making his professional MMA debut. The headlining bout at Moosin seems like it’s designed to give Pudzianowski (who comes up second to Krzysztof Soszynski in the “Fighters Whose Name I Hate Typing” category) a legitimate name to add to his meager record. A win over the former body builder does little to help Sylvia’s reputation, and a loss just sends him further down the heavyweight rankings.

LaRosa and Modafferi are two legitimate fighters in the world of women’s MMA, with LaRosa being one of the top P4P female fighters in the world. We’ve got the always intriguing striker vs. grappler dynamic for this bout, and Modafferi will no doubt be hungry to avenge her loss to LaRosa in their previous meeting. Strikeforce is supposed to be the home for women’s MMA but so far this year they’ve dropped the ball as far as promoting new talent. With a win here Modafferi could easily be pegged as an upcoming contender for Sarah Kaufman’s championship, but it’s tough to see where LaRosa goes from here unless she’s willing to move back up to 135 lbs. In any case this should be an entertaining scrap between two aggressive young ladies, and I’m looking forward to watching it in grainy flash video on Saturday morning.

Brendhan Conlan: Tool essentially squished my opinion into a little ball and smacked it over the fence for a homerun. Though the result of Sylvia’s almost-guaranteed slop-fest with Pudzianowski is fascinating in a sick way I’m far more interested in seeing how the action unfolds in LaRosa vs. Modafferi.

I don’t fault “The Maine-iac” for taking what he felt would be an easy win against an opponent with some name value (Ray Mercer) on the heels of losing 3-of-4 against top shelf competition. It was a calculated risk and a gamble he ultimately paid for by sacrificing his already-wavering reputation in the sport with both the loss and by showing up as though he’d trained at Pillsbury Top Team for the bout. However, embarrassing knockout aside, it has to be noted Sylvia had only finished a single opponent in the four years prior. Looking at his record seems to indicate Tim-meh benefited more from a distinct size advantage coupled with a shallow heavyweight pool, rather than a particular set of skills, to earn his reputation as a two-time UFC champion. His physical dimensions and past praise will always make Sylvia an attraction, but then again the same can also be said about the “World’s Biggest Ball of Yarn”. Fighting a 2-0 former strong-man who once tested positive for performance enhancing drugs has “freak show” appeal but doesn’t compare from a competitive standpoint to the other pairing mentioned in this topic’s subject line.

Modafferi is 7-1 since 2007 with the lone loss coming in a match she took on short notice against Marloes Coenen, a naturally bigger and equally respectable Mixed Martial Artist. LaRosa is currently riding a fifteen-fight win streak and is 18-1 over her eight-year career. They fought to a decision in 2006, so there’s a familiarity there that should breed engagement because both already have a fair idea of what to expect when they lock horns or stand and bang. Their combined skill, heart displayed in previous fights, and styles should make for an entertaining scrap and definitely one I find to be more appealing than that featuring 4X the weight.

What advice would you give Andrei Arlovski on the heels of losing his third consecutive fight?

Tool: Honestly, I have no idea. He’s spent the last two years dedicating a bulk of his training to boxing, yet he was clearly being handled on the feet by Antonio Silva. I don’t know if that owes more to Arlovski’s decline or Silva’s improvement, but there’s little left of the mystique “The Pitbull” once had. He’s still got plenty of name value amongst casual fans so he’ll keep getting fights as long as he wants to but there’s no reason to believe that he’ll have a spot amongst the heavyweight elite any longer.

If I had to mark one area for improvement it might just be cardio. Late in the fight it looked as though Silva had all but punched himself out (at least, that’s the only reason I can think of as to why he insisted on continually clinching against the cage) and Arlovski could have turned things around if he would have had to the gas to really pour it on. He’s got to be feeling better about his chin after taking some of Silva’s best shots, and I still believe that his striking looked awesome against Fedor (right up until the flying knee of course), so I don’t think I’m ready to write Andrei off completely. The long layoff between his last two fights might have played a factor, so I think he should try and get back in the cage as soon as possible if he’s to have any hope of breaking this losing streak.

Conlan: If I was in Arlovski’s ear I would concentrate on the positives stemming from his loss to “Bigfoot” Silva, encourage him to continue training outside of his comfort zone, and get him in touch with Georges St. Pierre (or comparable high-level athlete) to discuss the benefit potentially derived from speaking to a sports psychologist.

As Tool mentioned, “The Pitbull” absorbed a few clean shots from Silva and never went limp in the process. Obviously Arlovski is interested in actual victories, not moral ones, but his retention of consciousness is an important fact to note when owing 3/4 of his career losses to having it taken from him while Silva has an equal ratio of career wins by TKO. The bout as a whole was relatively close and essentially up for grabs. A few tweaks in strategy and perhaps a bit more mental focus between bells would have likely resulted in a Belarusian victor rather than a Brazilian one.

Moving on, my understanding is that Arlovski spent some time training at American Kickboxing Academy and Greg Jackson‘s Submission Fighting rather than working with his regular group of pre-fight handlers. I think it was a wise decision on his part regardless of result, as I truly believe improvement goes hand-in-hand with the type of preparation Mixed Martial Artists receive in camps as deep and experienced as those mentioned (as well as 5-10 others). There’s no doubt in my mind Andrei would get an infinite amount more out of sparring and grappling with actual peers rather than peons, and the type of knowledge found in places featuring guys like Jackson or Dave Camarillo is an asset any fighter is lucky to have in their corner.

Finally, though I have no idea if he’s already sought counsel on the matter, I think it would behoove Arlovski to spend some time speaking with a sports psychologist. There is no underestimating the influence an athlete’s mental state has on his/her performance during “go” time. I would be shocked if the manners in which Emelianenko and Brett Rogers beat him don’t still play his mind at some level, and I suspect his hesitance to fully engage against a lessened Silva in the final round may have actually been evidence of doubt-laced caution rather than questionable conditioning. I don’t think it’s far-fetched to think his self-esteem may have taken another dip with a third consecutive loss nor is it crazy to think Arlovski may enter his next match-up with additional stress/anxiety due to the possibility of going 0-4. Talking to a professional equipped to handle people in similar situations could genuinely help the former UFC Heavyweight Champion regain his mojo and get back to baring his fangs in the cage.

Of the four Brazilian’s to emerge victorious at “Strikeforce – Heavy Artillery”, who were you most impressed by – Rafael Cavalcante, Roger Gracie, “Jacare” Souza, or Antonio Silva?

Tool: Each fighter’s win was impressive for one reason or another, but the fighter whose performance stood out the most to me would have to be “Jacare.” I’ve been watching Souza’s career with interest for a few years now and I’m pleased to see him starting to make waves here in the U.S. While the announcers on Saturday night might have wanted you to think that “Jacare” and Joey Villasenor were having a great back-and-forth battle, the reality is that Souza dominated the fight from bell to bell. His cardio may not have been where he wanted it to be in the third round, but that’s only the second time in his career he’s gone the distance (and he won both times). As Jason High pointed out on Twitter, Souza isn’t like most jiu-jitsu fighters when it comes to taking the fight to the ground. Whereas Demian Maia or Thales Leites might pull guard, Souza has a mean shot that worked almost every time on Saturday. Once he’s on the ground there are few fighters in the world that can match his grappling ability, and I’ll give credit to the toughness of Villasenor for surviving and getting out of some bad situations. I’m sure he would have preferred to get the finish but in the end “Jacare” gave a dominant performance that puts him right at the top of the list of contenders for the Strikeforce Middleweight Championship. Now we just have to wait and see who he’s going to fight for that title (note to Scott Coker: please not “Mayhem” Miller).

Conlan: Credit to all of the names involved, and I can’t argue against Tool’s choice of “Jacare” (though I wouldn’t mind seeing he and Miller give it a third go-round with the Strikeforce title involved), but I was actually most-impressed by Rafael Cavalcante’s performance against Antwain Britt. “The Juggernaut” may not quite be at Villasenor’s level in terms of experience of success in the cage, but he also wasn’t coming off nearly a year’s layoff between bouts and has twice as many fights in the last two-and-half years as “Smokin” Joe does. Britt has heavy hands and put them on “Feijao” a few times to no avail only to end up slumped against the cage, then finished, due to some well-placed strikes from the blackbelt in BJJ. Cavalcante is now 9-for-9 in terms of finishing opponents he’s beaten in the first ten minutes of action and has yet to rely on his submission arsenal to pull out victories. The performance was too impressive as far as I’m concerned to opt for someone who fought to a decision.

Which would you rather see: Alistair Overeem fights Fedor Emelianenko before the year is up, or Overeem goes to the UFC and mixes it up with the new class of top heavyweights?

Conlan: Tough question! I’ll go with Overeem vs. Emelianenko by the width of a thread plucked from the Russian’s favorite sweater. I’m confident “The Demolition Man” will eventually end up in the UFC regardless of when the move actually takes place, while I think the number of Fedor’s future fights – especially against top competition – is a bit more debatable and its limited nature should be capitalized on. Also, assuming Emelianenko emerges victoriously from his San Jose showdown with Fabricio Werdum on June 26th, an added bonus to a bout with the imposing Dutch striker is it serving as a proper Strikeforce Heavyweight Championship match rather than inviting criticism of the title due to the involvement of lesser competition or enormous gaps in the strap being defended.

I’d love to see Overeem slugging it out in the UFC against Junior dos Santos, Cain Velasquez, Shane Carwin, or Brock Lesnar as much as anyone else, but all involved parties are young enough to see those outcomes to fruition within the next couple of years. On the other hand, “The Last Emperor” has recently dealt with a slew of nagging injuries and has little left to prove in his career outside of the Octagon (a possibility seeming less-and-less likely with each passing day). Putting the two together before year’s end would give Emelianenko a chance to further solidify his legacy against a respected, and much larger, heavyweight while also allowing Alistair an opportunity to become the first fighter to legitimately beat Fedor and reap the benefits attached to such a feat.

Tool: At the moment I would also probably have to lean towards Emelianenko vs. Overeem myself, if for no other reason than because Overeem represents the lone interesting opponent for Fedor at the moment. If Fedor can’t fight Alistair then what is there left for him to do? Fight worthless cans in Japan on New Year’s Eve? Take on guys out of their weight class like Dan Henderson and “King Mo” Lawal? I know Fedor doesn’t really care about taking on the best fighters in the world, but it’s something his fans would like to see if they’re going to have any ammunition in the ongoing pound-for-pound debate.

Overeem will have to make his way to the UFC sooner or later if he wants to considered the best in the world, but he does have the luxury of time. The UFC’s heavyweight division has four guys at the top right now, and none of them have faced each other yet. There’s still some work to be done in establishing the pecking order amongst Lesnar, Carwin, Velasquez, and Dos Santos, and by the time things start to sort themselves out the timing should be right for Overeem to come in and establish his place. If he enters the UFC as the man who shattered Fedor’s mystique, then the interest level shoots right up for any potential dream bout he takes in the octagon.

Should the winner of tonight’s Tyron Woodley/Nathan Coy fight become the top contender to Nick Diaz’s Strikeforce Welterweight Championship?

Conlan: I can see Woodley receiving a title shot with a win, especially with Jay Hieron’s Strikeforce future currently in limbo, but in no way should Coy get a crack at Diaz’s belt regardless of how convincing his method of victory might be. The three-fight streak he’s riding was preceded by back-to-back losses and involves competition with a combined record equating to a single win over even. Tonight only marks his second appearance in Strikeforce with the initial bout coming more than two years ago. Beating a rising star like “T-Wood” would be impressive but isn’t enough to thrust him into championship contention.

However, if Woodley walks away winner he’ll move to 7-0 as a professional and 4-0 in Strikeforce. He’s finished five of his six opponents in the first round and the sixth only made it through about ¾ of the second stanza. Another early submission or TKO would further establish the 28-year old as one of the company’s legitimate rising stars, and with a roster of welterweights thinner than Cory Hill trying to cut to 135-pounds it would make sense to give the Mizzou alumnus a shot. Additionally, if Strikeforce wants to capitalize on the recent heat between Jason “Mayhem” Miller and champ Nick Diaz, they can always make a future catch-weight bout for the two rivals while pairing Woodley against either Marius Zaromskis or Evangelista Santos (depending on who walks away winner at June 16th’s Strikeforce event in Los Angeles) to keep him active and erase any leftover doubts about how deserved his contendership is.

Tool: Brendhan’s right on the money here, as Strikeforce has a very real prospect in Tyron Woodley. His run on Strikeforce Challengers has been impressive, but with a win tonight the time will be right for him to take on a bigger role within the company. The welterweight division in Strikeforce is so devoid of talent that Woodley makes as much sense as anyone else. He also represents a great stylistic match-up for Diaz, as his wrestling pedigree could likely allow him to dictate where the bout takes place, and his heavy hands would be a good test for Diaz’s legendary chin and peppering punches. Other than the aforementioned Hieron, I can’t think of anyone else that Strikeforce could get to represent a credible threat to Diaz’s title.

TRUE/FALSE – His headlining spot on tonight’s Strikeforce Challengers card represents Matt Lindland’s last chance at relevancy in the current MMA scene.

Conlan: False, though certainly a loss to any associate of reality television whore Spencer Pratt would destroy the bulk of his remaining credibility as a contender. Lindland may be 3-4 over his last seven bouts but keep in mind the people he’s lost to over that period – Quinton “Rampage” Jackson (a split decision by the way), Vitor Belfort, Ronaldo “Jacare” Souza, and Fedor Emelianenko. It’s not as if low-level fighters are mopping the mat with the Team Quest founding-father. Yes, he’s 40 and on the downside of his career, but he’s not on the border of crossing over into “Ken Shamrock” territory. It would take a string of consecutive losses to fighters of Casey’s caliber before I’d comfortably state Lindland had lost all relevance in the sport.

Tool: I’ll go with true, as I can’t see Lindland doing anything of note in the near future should he fall to Kevin Casey. Personally I couldn’t look at myself in the mirror anymore if I lost to a guy that uses Spencer Pratt for credibility, but that’s me. Brendhan has a good point about the quality of opposition Lindland has lost to, but it’s also fair to point out that his last win was two years ago against the less-than-impressive Fabio Nascimento. “The Law” has gone 1-3 since then, and the only real interest he’s garnered from the MMA media is centered around his attempt at a political career and the upcoming documentary about his life. He doesn’t have the fan support of somebody like Jens Pulver, so will anybody still want to see Lindland fight if he can’t get a win or two along the way?

21 COMMENTS
  • Rece Rock says:

    -Tara LaRosa vs. Roxanne Modafferi more interesting for me…

    – I would advise AA to find a way to get a somewhat lucrative 3 fight deal signed with any promotion save your $$ and find out what else your good at after those 3 fights…

    – jacare in my opinion was most memorable that evening for me…

    – I’d rather see overeem fight fedor then move on to the UFC if there is no other interesting matchups at sf…

    – hmm not that many other options so in SF that makes sense guess…

    – I guess false because he can still be relevant in a local or regional promotion… Name recognition alone gets guys a pay check sometimes- so I guess you don’t have to be relevant to earn money – ask all these irrelevant fighterS getting ready for that Aussie card ?!

  • […] I said in this week’s “Grappling with Issues”, I’m actually looking forward to this particular contest more than the one headlining the […]

  • Brendhan Conlan says:

    My apologies to any readers thrown off by today’s delay. Made a mistake when originally posting that caused it to be invisible on the main page.

  • Guthookd says:

    I tell AA to go kick the shit out of the HW’s in Bellator in next year’s tournament.

    Sylvia is not exciting, so gotta go with the female bout.

    I would love nothing more that to see The Reem go to the UFC before Fedor gets a shot at him. To leave Fedor with no opponent would be a moral victory for us all. Not to mention that Reemer might actually do well in the UFC and would probably put on some awesome fights vs. the Top 10 over there.

    Lindland is no longer the law but more of a suggestion.

  • Lethal Liquid says:

    Lindland is done. He will still earn dough however. Seeing his name in lights those days are over. Jacare is an impressive fighter. Fun to watch. I’d rather see grass grow than watch Sylvia fight. Hell I’d rather see Horshack vs Screech II jump off. Looking forward to the Overeem vs Fedor showdown. The Ufc can wait. In that division for Strikeforce this is their swan song. Arlovski needs some cans believe it or not. To get some confidence and chase some of those combat jitters because my man is haunted by the KO

  • BigDave says:

    Ok, I have been very critical of both Overeem and Fedor in the past, but I have a few amendments in my feelings on the whole issue.

    First off I have to say that my comments on Overeem being a roid taker have aperantly been proven wrong and the man is just a genetic freak. His fight against Rogers was very predictable but impressive non the less. I cant help but feel the only reason Rogers was put in this fight was Fedors lack of interest in fighting anyone with a good shot at ruining his reputation as the top HW in the world(which I have been saying for a few years now).

    It is a fact that without Fedor winning fights M-1 is dead in the water. The Wamma belt is nothing but a joke, and until Strikeforce decides to tell M-1 and Fedor who they fight and when then cut them out if he refuses then he will continue to duck harder fights.That being said some do have werdum in there top 10 HW rankings where as I don’t quite regard him that high I have him in the top 20, but he has got the skills to possible upset Fedor should he make a mistake.

    A Fedor loss in this fight pulls his hype train to a screeching halt and i feel will render M-1 powerless in the future to co-promote if they try to refuse fights and then we will see if Fedor really wants to fight to be the best or if he goes to japan and only fights in freakshows. Now Fedor is an impressive fighter and has won huge fight in the past but his last fight against a legitimate Top ten fighter was Newyears Eve of 2004 when he won a decision over Big Nog and until he is willing to step up I can barely put him in my top 5.

  • Dr.Stoppage says:

    I want Overeem vs. Fedor before either has anything to do with the UFC.

    LaRosa vs.Modafferi must’ve been a great fight,
    but I think Big Tim subbing the strongest man in the world had a way bigger impact on the sport in general.
    Now doesn’t that make Big Timmah the strongest man in the world?

    AA ‘s management should consider going to Japan,where AA would eventually meet up with Big Tim at some point during the Super Hulk II Tournament.

  • LiverPunch says:

    Werdum
    Kharitonov
    Fedor
    Bigfoot
    Lasley
    Gracie
    Sylvia
    Barnett
    Aleksander
    Arlovski
    Rogers
    Monson
    Overeem

    Thanks to co-promoted events, all of these fighters are possible opponents. If you can’t find interesting match ups in there somewhere “SF hater” I can’t help you.
    I would love to see Overeem fight the UFC’s best too but if there are always going to be several organisations out there and not just the one (which seems to be the case and I think it always will be), I want him to stay out of the UFC and slowly pressure the ZUFFA to loosen it’s exclusive contract ways. So one day all top fighters can fight.
    Negative tick me if you must. but do you really think the UFC will ever be the only organisation? I don’t and I am sick of this Fedor not being able to fight Lesnar and all the other crap that comes with the UFC and others not allowing their fighters to fight elsewhere.
    BigDave??? How quickly we forget. Fedor has fought or tried to fight every top fighter possible out of the except for Overeem. Name one he hasn’t. He was trying to fight Couture before the UFC stopped it, when he was considered the biggest threat, he fought Arlovski when he was no.2 (after winning 8 of his last 10 including Buetello, Werdum, Nelson, Sylvia, Rothwell) he fought Sylvia at no.5 he wanted to face Barnett when he was at no.3, Rogers at 5, Wedum at 9, Crocop at 2, Hunt when he was considered top 20. My god you people talk shit. Big Dave name the fights Fedor has ducked….I,m waiting. You look at Anderson Silva’s last fights. In his fights since 2004 you will find Lutter, Irvin, Leites, Cote, Leben. Yeah a way higher standard than Fedors. A.Silva has not wanted to fight Hendo again, Belfort, Maia, Machida, Sonnen etc, etc and you start on Fedor who has taken on every top fighter possible asked for Dana to allow him to fight the UFC champions and has never lost, because he didn’t take Overeem on straight away.
    I’m telling you now if he went to the UFC and fought Dos Santos then Valasquez before jumping in the Cage with Lesnar you would say nothing.
    I keep asking people, who has Fedor ducked? and before all you “thinkers” jump on the “Overeem is soooo nasty that Fedor is afraid” bandwagon. At HW Overeem has beaten 1 top 10er, his name was Rogers, he has lost to Werdum (FEDORS NEXT OPPONENT) and Kharitonov. Oooooh I bet Fedor’s terrified. Overeem is good but is he the biggest threat Fedor has faced? No he wasn’t even a stable top 10 fighter until…he has never been one, at LHW or HW.

  • moosebaby02 says:

    WerdumKharitonovFedorBigfootLasleyGracieSylviaBarnettAleksanderArlovskiRogersMonsonOvereemThanks to co-promoted events, all of these fighters are possible opponents. If you can’t find interesting match ups in there somewhere “SF hater” I can’t help you.I would love to see Overeem fight the UFC’s best too but if there are always going to be several organisations out there and not just the one (which seems to be the case and I think it always will be), I want him to stay out of the UFC and slowly pressure the ZUFFA to loosen it’s exclusive contract ways. So one day all top fighters can fight.Negative tick me if you must. but do you really think the UFC will ever be the only organisation? I don’t and I am sick of this Fedor not being able to fight Lesnar and all the other crap that comes with the UFC and others not allowing their fighters to fight elsewhere.BigDave??? How quickly we forget. Fedor has fought or tried to fight every top fighter possible out of the except for Overeem. Name one he hasn’t. He was trying to fight Couture before the UFC stopped it, when he was considered the biggest threat, he fought Arlovski when he was no.2 (after winning 8 of his last 10 including Buetello, Werdum, Nelson, Sylvia, Rothwell) he fought Sylvia at no.5 he wanted to face Barnett when he was at no.3, Rogers at 5, Wedum at 9, Crocop at 2, Hunt when he was considered top 20. My god you people talk shit. Big Dave name the fights Fedor has ducked….I,m waiting. You look at Anderson Silva’s last fights. In his fights since 2004 you will find Lutter, Irvin, Leites, Cote, Leben. Yeah a way higher standard than Fedors. A.Silva has not wanted to fight Hendo again, Belfort, Maia, Machida, Sonnen etc, etc and you start on Fedor who has taken on every top fighter possible asked for Dana to allow him to fight the UFC champions and has never lost, because he didn’t take Overeem on straight away.I’m telling you now if he went to the UFC and fought Dos Santos then Valasquez before jumping in the Cage with Lesnar you would say nothing.I keep asking people, who has Fedor ducked? and before all you “thinkers” jump on the “Overeem is soooo nasty that Fedor is afraid” bandwagon. At HW Overeem has beaten 1 top 10er, his name was Rogers, he has lost to Werdum (FEDORS NEXT OPPONENT) and Kharitonov. Oooooh I bet Fedor’s terrified. Overeem is good but is he the biggest threat Fedor has faced? No he wasn’t even a stable top 10 fighter until…he has never been one, at LHW or HW.  (Quote)

    again with all the same arguements being repeated over and over just to prove your one claim…..we are all dumb ass’s and you rule everything.
    I keep seeing people coming up with new arguements to back there claims up while you hit up wikipedia all the time with the same stuff and facts over and over and over when you really not saying anything new.
    So you win.
    EVERYONE is ducking Fedor, You love him and he is the “Second Coming Of Christ”

  • BigDave says:

    Ok liverpunch, your right I don’t know what I was thinking, How could I forget that it is customary in MMA for the loser of the #1 contender fight to get the next shot at the champ and the winner to fight a guy who is at best ranked 9 or 10.

    As for not ducking Couture if he wanted that fight he would have signed with the UFC but he didn’t did he. Arlovski fought and beat rothwell, silvia, buentelo, and Nelson before fighting Fedor I’m sorry which of these guys is top 10? Fedor has only been fighting guy that have been cut by the UFC or aren’t good enough to be in the UFC. Oh ya please show me anywhere that says Mark hunt was ever in the Top 20 in MMA. Hunts Career record in mma is 5-6. Fedor beat an out of shape Matt lindland who by the way is a 185 fighter. He also has a win over Wagner “Zuluzinho” da Conceicao Martins, This guy is a world beater….wait he was beaten by butterbean by a keylock. Opps sorry bad example of the top talent he is fighting. Ok lets see he beat Hong Man Choi and he is a great MMA fighter he even beat up Jose Canseco….oh Canseco is a retired baseball player and not a fighter, and Choi is 2-3 as an MMA fighter, darn see I real am trying to find the great fighters he is beating.

    So lets see you want a list of who he is ducking, well thats easy enough he refused to sign with the UFC so there as the rankings stand today as seen on this site would be, Brock Lesnar, Shane Carwin, Cain Velasquez,Junior Dos Santos and frank Mir, and outside the UFC Alistair Overeem.

    So ya I guess you are right we should all bow at the feet of Fedor and name our first born after him even if it a girl.

  • moosebaby02 says:

    Ok liverpunch, your right I don’t know what I was thinking, How could I forget that it is customary in MMA for the loser of the #1 contender fight to get the next shot at the champ and the winner to fight a guy who is at best ranked 9 or 10.As for not ducking Couture if he wanted that fight he would have signed with the UFC but he didn’t did he. Arlovski fought and beat rothwell, silvia, buentelo, and Nelson before fighting Fedor I’m sorry which of these guys is top 10? Fedor has only been fighting guy that have been cut by the UFC or aren’t good enough to be in the UFC. Oh ya please show me anywhere that says Mark hunt was ever in the Top 20 in MMA. Hunts Career record in mma is 5-6. Fedor beat an out of shape Matt lindland who by the way is a 185 fighter. He also has a win over Wagner “Zuluzinho” da Conceicao Martins, This guy is a world beater….wait he was beaten by butterbean by a keylock. Opps sorry bad example of the top talent he is fighting. Ok lets see he beat Hong Man Choi and he is a great MMA fighter he even beat up Jose Canseco….oh Canseco is a retired baseball player and not a fighter, and Choi is 2-3 as an MMA fighter, darn see I real am trying to find the great fighters he is beating.So lets see you want a list of who he is ducking, well thats easy enough he refused to sign with the UFC so there as the rankings stand today as seen on this site would be, Brock Lesnar, Shane Carwin, Cain Velasquez,Junior Dos Santos and frank Mir, and outside the UFC Alistair Overeem.So ya I guess you are right we should all bow at the feet of Fedor and name our first born after him even if it a girl.  (Quote)

    zing

  • LiverPunch says:

    So you can’t name any he ducked?.
    So World rankings mean nothing unless they are refering to fighters in the UFC or fighters that support your bias?
    So Fedor has to sign with the UFC to prove he is the best rather than the other way around. Funny how MMA is in the “bizzaro world” where normal practices are reversed.
    and to say he must sign with the UFC is the same stupid shit I HEAR all the time. Brainless dribble, which is not thought through. As if business and fighter well being and freedom don’t count for anything. Sure Fedor should go to the UFC, he tried for 1 fight deals, Dana said no, he tried to fight their champ, Dana and the UFC stopped it through legal means, he asked Dana if he could face their champions publicly, Dana said no. But I’m sure your right, all the facts mean nothing it is just opinions of people like you that matter, not backed up by any facts, I’m still waiting for them. I’m sure A. Silva is the best P4P. I mean it’s not as if Lutter and Leites were dropped , or that Leites lay on his back whilst Silva pranced around or that Cote retired hurt. Maia had him in trouble though and Irvin was a monster. Face it dudes you don’t like Fedor. You say he is ducking dudes, that his opponents are no good, that he wont fight UFC guys (even though he has tried repeatidly to the point of the UFC stopping it through legal means). You guys talk shit in order to back up bias. Like Ive asked time and time again, who has he ducked? I still have not got an answer except “duh UFC”. Well he has asked many a time to be allowed to fight them hasn’t he? and the UFC say’s no, not him, the UFC says no! not unless you sign this exclusive contract. So who’s ducking who dickhead?. Look it up before YOU say the same bullshit again and again like you accuse me of. Go on look it up, or are you scared that you may find out something that shows you your’e wrong. Don’t worry about it, we all have to grow up someday. I’m sure Fedor asking to fight the UFC fighters was a ruse right? and him fighting every top fighter out of the UFC is because they are all shit right? and if Fedor really wanted to fight Couture they would have promoted it, stated their intentions and even starred in adds hyping it up right? oh wait they did. But sure Fedor is not good. I wonder how he got ranked No1 Hw and No.1 P4P then. Maybe the ones who decide theses things are basing it on reason and not listening to the opinions of nut huggers and a bunch of reason-less people who base arguments on gut feelings emotions and bias rather than facts and stats. I wonder why???. Go figure.

  • LiverPunch says:

    .

    So you can’t name any he ducked?.
    So World rankings mean nothing unless they are refering to fighters in the UFC or fighters that support your bias?
    So Fedor has to sign with the UFC to prove he is the best rather than the other way around. Funny how MMA is in the “bizzaro world” where normal practices are reversed.
    and to say he must sign with the UFC is the same stupid shit I HEAR all the time. Brainless dribble, which is not thought through. As if business and fighter well being and freedom don’t count for anything. Sure Fedor should go to the UFC, he tried for 1 fight deals, Dana said no, he tried to fight their champ, Dana and the UFC stopped it through legal means, he asked Dana if he could face their champions publicly, Dana said no. But I’m sure your right, all the facts mean nothing it is just opinions of people like you that matter, not backed up by any facts, I’m still waiting for them. I’m sure A. Silva is the best P4P. I mean it’s not as if Lutter and Leites were dropped , or that Leites lay on his back whilst Silva pranced around or that Cote retired hurt. Maia had him in trouble though and Irvin was a monster. Face it dudes you don’t like Fedor. You say he is ducking dudes, that his opponents are no good, that he wont fight UFC guys (even though he has tried repeatidly to the point of the UFC stopping it through legal means). You guys talk shit in order to back up bias. Like Ive asked time and time again, who has he ducked? I still have not got an answer except “duh UFC”. Well he has asked many a time to be allowed to fight them hasn’t he? and the UFC say’s no, not him, the UFC says no! not unless you sign this exclusive contract. So who’s ducking who dickhead?. Look it up before YOU say the same bullshit again and again like you accuse me of. Go on look it up, or are you scared that you may find out something that shows you your’e wrong. Don’t worry about it, we all have to grow up someday. I’m sure Fedor asking to fight the UFC fighters was a ruse right? and him fighting every top fighter out of the UFC is because they are all shit right? and if Fedor really wanted to fight Couture they would have promoted it, stated their intentions and even starred in adds hyping it up right? oh wait they did. But sure Fedor is not good. I wonder how he got ranked No1 Hw and No.1 P4P then. Maybe the ones who decide theses things are basing it on reason and not listening to the opinions of nut huggers and a bunch of reason-less people who base arguments on gut feelings emotions and bias rather than facts and stats. I wonder why???. Go figure.  

    Zing.
    Idiot.

  • LiverPunch says:

    For the record, I think Lesnar would beat Fedor. But people keep saying he ducked Alistair overeem. Those same people said he was a roid freak, that he was ducking SF for YEARS. Alistair Overeem is good but he hardly breaks into the top 10 as it stands and is ranked lower than Fedors next opponent who holds a fairly recent victory over Overeem. People also say he has ducked the UFC. this is bullshit. He wants to fight the UFC fighters, has stated so publicly and even tried to fight the UFC champion but was stopped by the UFC, he wanted to fight one fight in the UFC under co-promotion and they said no. This is all fact. So to say he ducked the UFC fighters is the opposite of the truth. the UFC is doing far more of the ducking. They just can’t come to an agreement. This is the truth and you are just taking a side, hearing what you want to and running with it. I don’t love Fedor , I like his fights and think a great deal of him but you guys are just talking bullshit and lies and that pisses me off. Get your facts right. We will see if the Overeem fight happens or not. Though I’ll bet if Fedor wins you will all still say “Fedor hasn’t fought anybody good recently” which translates to “the UFC is the best ever and I love it to bits” usually.

  • AR15 says:

    Man liverpuss…did you just cut/copy/paste everything from the Collision course page?? Seems like i’ve already read this before.
    Cant act like everyones a Fedor hater. Like most people, I dont hate the guy, i like to watch his fights…kinda. But if someone mentions that he’s not the best P4P, you come unglued as if you were Fedors bitch. You want this list of fighters that he’s ducked out from besides the UFC…but in my opinion, thats a big enough list in itself. You’re a book nerd, you find the list cause its out there(much like yourself) I know Fedor said he’d fight “1fight” contract w/ the UFC champ(s) but the UFC keeps saying no…well no $h!t, bonehead. Dana, The Fertitta Brothers & Zuffa are way too smart of a business men to ever do that. If Fedor got his 1 fight contract for the title & Fedor won. Fedor & M1 global would hold out until they got 1/2 the assets of the UFC & Zuffa before Fedor would ever defend the title…or something similar to that. So yes, Dana says no to BS like that. However, i do agree that he(Dana) should allow more of his fighters to fight outside of his promotion…but at the same time i understand why he doesn’t. Fighters are his investment, it’d be like a Les Schwab trusting Discount Tire Co. to take care of Les Schwab product. Right now UFC is the Big Dog & until another company gets big enough to compete, I dont see why the UFC would ever let anyone besides a Houston Alexander fight outta the UFC while still under contract.
    So if Fedor’s the “Best P4P in the world” then maybe he should start acting like it & sign a 2-4 fight contract w/ the UFC (w/out his lil weak company getting its logo printed next to every UFC logo) and spend the next 1-3 yrs proving he’s the best fighter. Its obvious he’s not the best business man, Dana proved that a while ago. Maybe Fedor should hang the business part the game up & just focus on one thing at a time…fighting.

    Now lets all watch liverpusses panties get twisted in a bunch…

  • Dr.Stoppage says:

    I respect anyone’s opinion who has the intestinal fortitude to have the username LIVERPUNCH.
    Fedor is #1. oney
    AND Fedor is a business.
    Fedor has stated that he doesn’t care about rankings,money,etc.
    I like the fact that Fedor and his peeps have positioned himself so that even when he KO’s his opponents, he can still get scrutenized.
    Best business move ever.
    Ohhhhh Ahhhhhhh he’s a chicken because he won’t sign with the UFC.
    Ohhhh Ahhhhhh who will/should he fight next?
    It don’t matter,he’ll win.
    Hey man ,at the very least, Fe

  • Dr.Stoppage says:

    Yah got cut off.
    At the very least,Fedor has proven that it ain’t about the fight,it’s about the fighter.
    Fedor is about the business of fighting.
    Good for him..
    Too bad for us fans,but at least we have places to vent.

  • Dr.Stoppage says:

    Fedor can stop fighting tomorrow,
    and it wouldn’t bother him a bit.
    He’s investested in himself.

  • moosebaby02 says:

    I remember there was a time when men took pride in being man.
    if he really wants to fight then send the babysitters home and fight. its not about the money but “HE Fedor” and i say this since he dosent know how to speaks for him self and have other people who have his best intrest in him ($$$$$$$) needs to step up and say that
    “I wanted to fight in the UFC but they wouldnt give me the one fight contact that i wanted so i can take there belt if i win and not defend it like overeem and and hold them hostage until i get all there first born or half the proceeds from the card like i wanted cause i dont care for the money” or something like that.
    Hey sliver i mean liver you were there in the room…how did it go again???

  • Rece Rock says:

    LiverPunch…

  • BigDave says:

    Looks like I opened up a can of worm here…..Just the way I like it.

    Now to set the record straight and to say it in a way that maybe even LiverPunch can understand, is Fedor a great fighter…yes, would he be even money against anyone in the world?(except Cain cause he is the man)….yes. Does he have the worst representaion in the sport of MMA?…yes.

    M-1 wanting to co-promote with the UFC would be like me wanting to sell my homemade bbq burgers at McDonalds, Why would a company as well known as the ufc want to do buisness with a low rent backwoods russia company how only has one marketable asset and no working buisness model.

    Oh and can someone explain to me why Fedor needs a translator when it well known that he speaks and understands english. Now this may sting a bit but to all the Fedor nuthuggers out there, Fedor is not the p4p best in the world, nor is he top in the HW division to anyone who really watches the sport.

    the top 5 HW are imo:

    1. Brock
    2. Cain
    3. carwin
    4. Overeem
    5. dos antos

    The top pound for pound are.

    1. GSP
    2. BJ (even though I hate him with a passion)
    3. Anderson silva
    4. Jose Aldo

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